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One last thing I want to say about all this, is the I guess somewhat unique challenge I've faced, that one of my biggest forms of compulsive loss of self-control is one that looks (and genuinely is, depending on a person's goals) hyper-productive from the outside.
This last Saturday I had one of the most dramatic breakdowns of self-control I've had in a while. Did I go eat a tub of fried chicken? No. Did I drink a whole bottle of whiskey or indulge in some other kinds of drugs? No. Did I even just spend all day in my pajamas in bed watching cartoons? Well, that's close, but still.. no.
You know what I did? I spent 18 hours straight, literally no breaks except to run and get coffee or food, writing computer code for my side app and future software business. That's great, right? Well, I'm not gonna complain, some people couldn't stand to do that. But that's not what I want with my life right now, and I've already explained on here many times that this kind of workaholism is a form of anxiety-driven avoidance. Writing software (also what I do for my day job) is my comfort zone. It may be "challenging", but not at all in the same way all this other stuff is. It is, ironically, my easy way out.
I paid for this loss of self-control dearly. The way I felt at the end of that day was hard to describe, but it's all the "physical" things I've talked about, multiplied by 10. I actually felt dizzy and nauseated. I was highly anxious despite being on phenibut. The thought of leaving the house to do anything else seemed daunting to me. I was "tired" but I couldn't sleep (because I couldn't stop coding). This was in such sharp contrast to the Saturday before this, where I immediately took on work that needed to be done, cleaning my room, going to pick up some clothes, doing approaches at the Pier. I felt awesome that day, basically high. The difference was that Saturday, I did what I needed to do. This last Saturday, I did what I felt like doing. I felt it as I got out of bed and went straight to my computer: "this isn't what today is supposed to be for". I ignored that voice of reason, and followed the baby's voice: "BUT I WANT IT!!"
I cannot delude myself by saying, "that was productive, you worked hard and didn't goof off that day". No, I completely goofed off, worse than I've done in a long time. I said in a previous post in this thread I'm not touching that app's code beyond what is absolutely necessary to keep it alive (none of what I did that day counts, this was all enhancements that didn't need to be done now at all), because right now my goal is to Get Laid.
Let that be a lesson to myself, and anyone else with similar experiences. The reason you feel depressed and anxious is because you're goofing off and you know it. You might start thinking those feelings prevent you from being able to get serious. That's when you get stuck. The way out of those feelings (which are, basically, "I don't feel like doing anything") is to act in direct contradiction to them. And if you have "projects", whether they're creative or business or whatever... you know damn well you're juggling 5 of them because you're procrastinating on whichever 1 is the one you really want to finish right now. Even hyper-focusing on one, if it isn't the one you really want to see finished right now, it's a coping mechanism and a loss of self-control.
(Addendum: I'm increasingly convinced if I went to a psychiatrist and recounted all of this they would diagnose me with ADHD, just like the school doctors did when I was a kid. That's a topic for another day.
Boy was Chris right
Last night I was meditating on this recent discipline breakdown, and I had a classic moment of authenticity that hit me like a ton of bricks:
I'm addicted to computers
I'm giving that addiction up. Unplugging my desktop and packing my laptop away somewhere, and I'm only allowed to use it on my rest day of Wednesday evening (I picked this as my rest day because it's before the nights out on Thursday, Friday and Saturday).
Fuck my laziness and fuck my excuses. I'm just goofing off on my laptop all the time. If I thought I was "tired" two weeks ago, I'll show myself what "tired" is. I'm going all in like I've never gone before. I don't care how I feel. I'll know what it really means to be exhausted after enough of this. I'm so sick of being so weak. I'm gonna prove to myself how strong I am. You know how I know I'm full of shit saying I'm tired? I'm having trouble sleeping. If I was really exhausted I'd be sleeping like a baby.
I'm restarting fat loss when I get back on Monday, and I'm going as extreme as possible (protein-sparing modified fast) with the goal of reaching 6% body fat in three weeks. I'm gonna be the leanest motherfucker on this whole forum. Watch me. Incidentally, I didn't mention this in the video, but the pool party I went to in Vegas yesterday, I was probably in the top 5 leanest guys there. Plenty of guys who were more jacked than me, but my abs were popping way more. Don't know how much girls care, but it definitely made me more confident. Still not good enough. I have to be as maxed out as nature/reality will allow me to be.
By forbidding playing on the computer, I have nothing to do after work and on the weekends except hit on girls. To make it more concrete, I get out of work around 5pm, and I should stay out until 8pm hitting on girls. Then I can get home by 8:30pm, and cook and eat dinner by 9:30pm, at which point I'll get on Tinder. On the weekends, it should be an all day thing. I want to just see if it's possible for me to do this. If only for one fucking Saturday, to get up, go out and not come back except to eat lunch and dinner. Take a nap after dinner, then out to bars. If only one time, I want to see, just to be able to say so, that I did this. I will not touch my fucking electronics on Saturdays!!! (or Sundays. During the week I will only touch electronics as needed at my job).
Let's make that concrete: next Saturday, the goal is to see how many girls I can hit on, and how many numbers I can get. I'll keep both stats. I can try to beat the previous record every Saturday.
I just read
, not sure if I've seen this one before.
I've been focused on "what you say doesn't matter", which I think is true for whether a not a girl is available and likes you. There's no such thing as "convincing" a girl to be sexually available with the right "material".
Okay, but it still matters what you say, for the purpose of screening. You pick the right things to say, and more importantly do (touching), in order to filter out the girls who aren't available. I'm past the point where I need validation from being able to approach girls or get their numbers. And frankly, getting into a screening mindset lowers approach anxiety even more.
My standard small talk I've been using is "I hope she likes me" stuff. I don't really care what the answer to any of those questions is. I'm just doing it because I think I need to, like I'm not "allowed" to just say, "hey I think you're cute, are you single? Yeah, wanna get a drink tonight? Let me grab your number". The article talks about flirting more than this, but even that's probably a move in the right direction. I can tell you it's easier to do that to girls, and I would feel less of a sting from the one who act dismissive.
I should also develop some "routines" like Chris described in the article. This may sound like PUA "material" stuff, but it's not. It's not intended to "win" girls over. It's more for me to enjoy myself, and to more effectively screen. I like the bicep thing, which I've already done over 50 times in the AA program. I thought of the "stop checking me out/stop undressing me with your eyes" routine too. That is a perfect thing to do if you actually catch a girl looking at you, but I actually like the idea of doing it anyways. If I say that to a girl who obviously didn't even see me, I'm just being cocky and flirtatious. That will screen her. But the bicep thing is good because it involves touching. With practice this will become more natural, but I'm gonna try to come up with a few other "routines" that involve touching girls.
There's no reason to not use the same "routines" at day and night. The only difference at night is that I escalate faster for any girls who pass the first screen. I mentioned this in the video. I have a set of "drills" I can work on to develop killer instinct at night. The problem with these "drills" are is that they are so close to real approaches, it's basically a waste of time. I should just execute the following set of steps on as many girls as I can at night:
1: Walk up, squeeze her arm, say "you're cute/sexy"
2: Introduce myself, shake her hand and try to hold onto it.
3: Instruct her to follow me to another part of the venue. Notify her friends ("hey, I'm gonna borrow your friend for a second")
4: Talk to her while rubbing her shoulder or putting my arm around her waist for ~60 seconds. Sexually charged convo ("you look sexy tonight, you like driving all the boys crazy", "you look like a wild girl, I'll bet you know how to have fun", etc.)
5: Try to make out with her, for 30-60 seconds if she's down.
6: Instruct her to leave with me.
Now, if she gets screened out at any of these steps, should I take her number? I'm thinking no, unless she fails test #6. If she followed me somewhere and made out with me, she may be sexually available (or she may just like making out with cute dudes in bars), but have bad logistics that night preventing her from leaving with me. Might as well take her number and hit her up the next night.
If she doesn't let me kiss her, as far as I'm concerned she's not DTF and I'm barking up the wrong tree getting her number. I might think "why not get her number then just invite her over or something", but I could end up in a situation like Chris described in the article. Yeah, she said if he waited until the 3rd/4th date he might get some, but who says that isn't bait to get him to keep taking her out? Plus I just like the idea of being a fuckboi to the extreme. It's so diametrically opposed to who I used to be. It actually feels quite good to smash my old personality to pieces.
With day game, this is what I'm thinking as a general game plan:
1: "Hey I know this is random, but I thought you were cute, wanted to say hi"
2: Introduce myself and shake her hand, try to hold onto her hand.
3: Flirtatious/sexually charged "routine" of some sort for a couple of minutes where I keep touching the girl.
4: Ask her what her plans are that night
5: Invite her to get drinks as early as possible based on the answer to 4, and take her number
This is probably a more effective way of screening than just asking, "are you single?" Some girls may say "yes" but they're still not sexually available (they're boyfriend seekers). If they stick around through step 3 and give me their number after saying, "come get a drink with me tonight", they more than likely are (even if they're not single).
I may need some practice, like I might get nervous at first running the flirtatious routine, do it it timidly, and end up coming off as lame or creepy. I'll learn. I pick this shit up quick.
Nice video sweatervest. Good job turning that hooker down too. I've been there myself and it's a slippery slope.
Really like you're "routines". Seems like you got to the essence of what cold approach is for. I have a pretty big phobia about dancing but it's all in my head. Whenever I'm out at night I realize how many opportunities I'm wasting by being afraid to dance.
Yo colorado, hit me up if you want to go to something like that some time. Give me 4 months or so. My brain and body can't handle that kind of abuse too often LOL. That was the Marriott Grand Chateau.
So yeah Vegas and EDC was fun, but I didn't get laid, and there's a couple reasons why. First one is just lack of full effort on my part. I definitely could have tried harder. Not gonna let myself off the hook for that. Another problem is I didn't have a game plan. I went to a pool party on Thursday, did the arm squeeze "hey cutie" routine on a bunch of girls and chatted with a couple, but was I gonna get them to leave that event (tickets were $100, and there was no re-entry) to go fuck in my hotel room? I don't know. Like I said, I could have tried harder, but I'm not sure how realistic that is. Finally, with EDC itself, the logistics could not possibly be worse for trying to get laid there. You have to take a shuttle, which is 1-2 hours long (each way), out to the venue, and at the venue itself there's literally no private areas. Your best bet would be to take numbers and try to get with girls when you and her are both back at your hotels. But it's a dusk to dawn rave. Most people left around 4-5am, and didn't get home until 7am, coming down from their rolls and trying to sleep so they can do it all over again the next night. I'm NOT saying it's impossible, not at all. The other side is that there are shitloads of super hot girls at those things. But I wouldn't go to something like that (especially with how expensive it is) if all you want to do is get laid.
That's not why I went. I bought tickets back in February when I was still "multitasking" my life and trying to do more social shit. I was actually initially planning to join up with a group of people from the Rave Meetup I'm in. I later decided once I committed fully to Getting Laid to go there by myself and creep around.
The other thing I experienced was that rolling and hitting on girls is not a good combo, not for me at least. People who have rolled will know what I'm talking about. That shit definitely puts you in an awesome mood, but it's not an anxiolytic, it's the opposite. I was only able to handle hitting on girls at the beginning before it kicked in.
I was beating myself up and stressing out over not giving it my all to fuck there, but all in all... it was fun, and I'm not doing myself any good forbidding myself from ever doing anything besides trying to get laid. It's probably burning me out and contributing to my laziness over the last few weeks. Dude, go fuckin' see a concert and unwind once every few months. Yes, I want to get so comfortable with hitting on girls that it's something I do even when I'm unwinding, but I'm not there yet. I will be in 6-12 months.
I did spontaneously approach one girl in the street in Vegas, but she was there with her family, and I had no game plan for that. That was just to prove to myself I could do it.
On Wednesday this week, after I got back, I went to do some approaching at Whole Foods. I had a good amount of anxiety leading up to it (I was also generally anxious that day... post-roll recovery haha), since it had been a while, but I jumped right back in. I approached I think 7 girls, who all said they weren't single. I think this was in less than an hour. It should be totally feasible for me to approach 10 girls per day. It's just a matter of running into that many attractive girls, and that seems to happen enough at my usual places.
I have a date planned (drinks near my place) with the bangin' girl I approached two Sundays ago. We've been texting back and forth some, I called her this evening and confirmed a date tomorrow. I am going to start calling girls regularly. Texting is obnoxious to me when it's me trying to set something up. If I want to set up a meetup with a girl I'm gonna try getting her on the phone using Chris' "call right when they text" idea. Excited about that, hopefully she won't flake. She seems pretty interested.
Beyond that I'm just still struggling to recover my discipline. Slow process but I'm moving in the right direction. Taking cold showers, doing all the daily chores. I need to do a better job of not touching my electronics, and I need to do some cardio every day, both for fat loss and because it gets me energized and puts me in a good mood. I still feel like I have no libido or horniness driving me, but I know it's a mistake to wait for that to come and then act. I have to get laid to bring it back.
sweatervest wrote: Yo colorado, hit me up if you want to go to something like that some time. Give me 4 months or so. My brain and body can't handle that kind of abuse too often LOL. That was the Marriott Grand Chateau.
Will do. I usually just take some phenibut at that kind of stuff. Drugs don't work for me anymore haha. I'm surprised you think rolling and hitting on girls doesn't work well. That stuff used to turn me into the biggest social butterfly. I had zero anxiety and was super interested in meeting everybody and asking them super personal questions. The only bad thing about picking girls up on it was it made my dick not work. It wouldn't get up and I couldn't get off afterwords either. I used to use stuff like that an alcohol to self medicate my anxiety when talking to girls.
I hit on 7 girls while grocery shopping today. The first two were funny. First girl was as I was walking in. She very loudly said, "aww thanks, but I have a boyfriend!" so I think a lot of people overheard it. Next girl said to me, "I just heard you call that other girl cute"
I ended up going like 3 weeks without doing any approaching. Obviously for the goal of Getting Laid that's nothing but bad, but I got some value out of it: the ease with which I jumped back into it (I didn't pace around or chicken out on certain girls, I immediately jumped in, hit on girls with friends, chased girls out of places, etc.) has proven to me my AA is never going to come back, and that takes some of the pressure off. I can enjoy this more now instead of being constantly worried I'll "lose" it. I can approach for the sake of Getting Laid, rather than the sake of "being able to approach".
3 girls on Sunday, 5 girls on Monday, 4 or 5 yesterday, not sure, so let's call it 4. Been Tindering too. I'm boosting every night to try to get back into the groove quickly.
Went out on Saturday night. This one girl grinded on me hard for a few minutes, then stopped and told me she was exhausted. I got her number, but I should have tried to take her somewhere else in the place and make out with her.
No girls Wednesday, that's my designated rest day for the week. 14 on Thursday, none on Friday (should have gone out but didn't), 5 yesterday, none today due to messing up my schedule around some errands I had to do.
So total for the week (M-Su) is 5 + 4 + 14 + 5 = 28. That's the most I've ever done in one week, but not quite in my 30-35 target range. Let's see if I can hit that this coming week.
I've gotten I think over 20 matches on Tinder this week, doing daily boosting. No numbers or really any convos going. I got one number from the approaches, but I didn't follow up on it (she didn't respond when I texted her after meeting her, but that's not a good reason to not try to set something up).
Some things I want to play around with:
* My "routine" has been to ask girls if they're single right after introducing myself, and bail if they say no. Some guys have suggested I shouldn't do that. My feelings are mixed on this, because I'm trying to stay focused on screening rather than "trying" to get numbers or dates or whatever with girls who end up being unavailable. However, I've never heard Chris say to do this, so I think I'm going to try not doing it, especially given the next point...
* I've mentioned this before but forgotten about it. Ask these girls to get a drink THAT NIGHT. No more "let me grab your number and we'll hang out". If I'm not busy I should try to get them to have a drink with me right then and there.
* On Tinder, use edgier photos and screen with an opener like, "hey you're sexy, I'm just looking for some casual fun, let's grab a drink and see where it goes".
It's the Summer of Love. I'm super horny again because I'm only jerking off once per week (I'm gonna try going full no fap again) and since I'm not starving myself my libido is back in full force. I want some fuckin' strange. Let's make this shit happen. I'm trying to get at least one lay in for July.
My mate asks girls if they're single as soon as he says hi, even before he introduces himself. "Hi, you're hot, you single?" all in one breath. For the record, he gets laid from cold approach FAR more than me (he's had 45 total lays in his life).
So I don't think it hurts to ask it, it's certainly not ruining his chances.
"No more "let me grab your number and we'll hang out". If I'm not busy I should try to get them to have a drink with me right then and there."
Yeah I need to do this too.
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I didn't think the "Get Hung" guide would have girls eyeing my bulge. It did.
I didn't think that your exercise and diet advice would have girls checking me out. It did.
I DEFINITELY didn't think that your hair-loss prevention would fix my hairline. Not in a billion years. It mother fucking did. You saved me a crazy amount of time, a ton of money, unnecessary pain, and destroyed my #1 source of anxiety. DESTROYED IT.
Kratom is next!
To anyone reading this, follow through, read this material, APPLY this material, and enjoy life.